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Mission Accomplished: Jim Douglas Kills Composting in the Intervale

by: odum

Thu Feb 28, 2008 at 20:23:55 PM EST


The news from the Free Press today was a shocker:

Beset on all sides by regulatory challenges, the beleaguered Intervale Center announced Wednesday night it will close its majorbig [sic] composting operation sometime the coming months.

The facility cannot afford to answer pollution concerns and obtain recently mandated permits, Perkins said.

At the Chittenden Solid Waste District, General Manager Tom Moreau said the district will urgently seek alternatives.

The Intervale has been a crown jewel, not just of Burlington, but of Vermont. Find another city which has increased its agricultural base in the last two decades. The reclaimed dump of a site has not only been a thriving economic engine and community-enhancer, it has maintained a uniquely successful, large scale composting operation, diverting tons of waste in Chittenden and neighborig counties that was otherwise destined for landfills, and generating agricultural products in the process. It is something I've heard Democrats, Progressives, Republicans and Independents speak of with pride.

But not all Republicans. A couple in particular became fixated on the Democrats and Progressives involved in its operation - particularly Democratic Speaker of the House Gaye Symington and Progressive Representative (and organic farmer) David Zuckerman. When it came out that runoff from the composting operation was not up to specs, Governor Jim Douglas and his attack dog, Agency of Natural Resources Secretary George Crombie could hardly maintain their glee. They tied the discharge violation around Zuckerman's and Symington's necks as tightly as they could, despite a continuing history of ignoring meaningful permit violations that don't have high profile Dems and Progs associated with them.

But the problem was that they were dealing with environmentalists, and unlike their GOP business buddies who might mutter and fume about having to cowtow to the tree-huggers, the folks at the Intervale were fully and humbly prepared to comply - providing, in the process, an example to others.

That would never do for Douglas. So what does he have Crombie do? Revoke the Intervale's classification as a farm, retroactively making it subject to all the Act 250 provisions it had never built into its business plan. The new, unexpected burdens - particularly ones relating to concerns about possible siting on archeological sites - suddenly dumped never-accounted for costs that, with an unfriendly agency, would clearly go well into six figures.

If you're still entertaining the notion that this wasn't a political hit job, consider the rumor in circulation that I was able to confirm with a source close enough to know. In a conversation with the Intervale Director, Crombie openly gloated that he had the Intervale "in a noose" and wasn't about to let go.

That's right. He actually said "in a noose."

So an operation that has diverted tens of thousands of tons of solid waste from landfills and kept nearly a million gallons of liquid waste from wastewater treatment facilities over the last two decades, serving as a model of urban agriculture and green economic success is closing its doors.

And all for one reason, and one reason only: pure, vindictive, political thuggery. Congratulations, Jim. You win.

odum :: Mission Accomplished: Jim Douglas Kills Composting in the Intervale
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Composting thuggery (3.00 / 1)
So what will it take for the Democrats and the Progressives to get together defeat this guy ?  

Honestly, there appears to be plenty of blame to go around here. (1.00 / 1)
I'm no expert on what goes on down at the Intervale, since I've only been down there a few times.  Composting is definitely a smart way to deal with certain types of waste, but I'm not so sure that the immediate flood plain of the Winooski River is the best place for such an operation.  Even if there wasn't a river flood that impacted the site, anyone that's been down there in a strong rainstorm knows that it gets pretty soggy pretty quick in that area down there.

Sure, this issue is mostly a pure, political hit by the Republicans (who are getting a lot of mileage out of it across the entire state recently), but this also does indeed highlight the burdens that our anti-development attitude in this state unfortunately reaps sometimes.  It's too bad all-around IMO...

Be excellent to each other and party on dudes!


You're buying into the bullshit (3.25 / 4)
There is no "there" there. The "anti-development" attitude is a concoction. Who is "anti-development?" Anti-sprawl, sure. Development where it wont cause harm - of course. But that's not enough for Douglas and the pave Vermont crowd.

There was a violation at the Intervale. It was being addressed. They not-so-arbitrarily changed the Intervale's status in order to create a poster child for a phony issue and attack political foes. Period. If you wanna buy their bullshit story, it just means that Douglas is snowing even more people than I thought.

undercaffeinated


[ Parent ]
Huh? (4.00 / 1)
What does this mean?

There is no "there" there.

I think you're taking this issue a lil too personally.  I already said it was mostly a political hit job, but I think there's more to it than that.  Saying that doesn't mean that I'm on the GOP's side BTW.

If you think there isn't an "anti-development at almost all costs" movement in VT, then, I think, you haven't been paying attention much to what's been going on in this state for quite some time now.  "Anti-sprawl" in VT is a joke IMO.  You want to see sprawl?  Take flight out to CO...we're light-years beyond that here in backwards VT.  

Our economy here is a joke...having a state where if you're not working for some form of govt. you're likely working for IBM is not a sustainable strategy, period.  Small businesses are fine, but we can't all make ice cream and cheese either.  Agriculture has been a dead industry for decades now.  No one is really out to "pave Vermont" either.  That's also a concoction from the other side.  There's a middle ground that isn't being exploited here I think.

Be excellent to each other and party on dudes!


[ Parent ]
Ah.... (3.00 / 3)
Now I get it... you're one of them.

How wrongly reductionist are you gonna go?  VT's economy has little to do with agriculture (directly) and most of us live outside of Chittenden County.

I've never in my life met anyone (in Vermont) who is against "development" at "all costs"- AND I promise you this: I know the most radical, anti-establishment, conspiracy-minded, anti-capitalist, anti-sprawl people you (or anyone on this site) can imagine.  If there is an "anti-development at all costs" movement, they are so fringe that even I don't know about them; and trust me, I'm in with the "fringe" crowd (I helped found the SVR, mind you, in 2001).

Our economy here is a joke

So then tell me why it is that we're weathering the housing meltdown better than most (if not all) States? tell me how it is that our budgets, in comparison to those of other New England (and indeed, U.S.) States is so much healthier and stable?  Is our economy good and perfect? no; but we're a hell of a lot better off than most other States....

And sprawl? gimme a break... have you looked at Chittenden County? Greater Montpelier or greater Brattleboro?  That is sprawl.  Is it on the same scale as other places? not always or even often.  But by definition, it is sprawl in it's most destructive and ugly form.  Just as your NPR refers to "Israeli settlements" in the Gaza Strip, when you drive North on I-89 through Williston, look to your right: if our journalists were truely objective than they would rightfully refer to this area of VT as an "American settlement".... sprawl is certainly happening.

-In America the people fear their government; in France, it is the government that fears the people

www.integralpsychosis.com


[ Parent ]
Try again (0.00 / 0)
No, I'm really not one of "the Tigers"...lol...let's not get the gun out so quick to shoot the messenger on this one.  Last time I heard, a plurality of people in VT lived inside Chittenden county, but I'm sure if the rest of you guys wanted to gang up on us that you could take us in a fight.   :)

Let's look at the current anti-Moran Plant redevelopment crowd for a second.  These people, if you boil away a lot of the baloney that they put out, are opposed to a multi-million dollar redvelopment of a building on the Burlington waterfront because it might disturb a granite sculpture nearby.  They'd rather tell a group of businesses (some from Europe) to take a hike and invest their own millions of dollars elsewhere.  Burlington needs a larger tax base and more jobs...not more sculptures.  Sure, in a perfect world, that location would be pristine and undisturbed, but the world isn't perfect.  No one is talking about building a Wal-Mart on the Burlington waterfront either.  

Look at the supposedly largest downtown redevelopment in VT's history in Winooski.  A good chunk of the space there is still unused.

Could it be that, as of very recently, Vermont had one of the lowest housing stocks in the country??  One person's "sprawl" is another persons suburb...you know, those places that people live in nearby a city or town when they can't actually live inside that said city or town?  Especially when it's extremely difficult to get approval to build high-density housing inside those said cities and towns...since that urban renewal thing that worked out oh-so-well.

Like I said before, take a flight out to CO and see what real sprawl looks like.  Burlington, in certain circles, is called "Boulder-East", and we're so far away from the run-away development in the Denver to Boulder corridor that it's not even funny.  Look at that crappy Maple Tree Place development in Williston.  They would have done that in CO in a few weeks instead of the several years that it took VT to get it done...and it's still not fully occupied.

Be excellent to each other and party on dudes!


[ Parent ]
But (0.00 / 0)
We shouldn't be judging ourselves by 'how bad it is somewhere else".  

You can read more of JD Ryan at five before chaos. But why would you want to?

[ Parent ]
hold on a second... (3.00 / 1)
if housing stocks are so low, why is the winooski space still empty?

Also, mapletree place has commercial space, not residential.  apples and oranges comparison...

I'm not sure of your overall point.  It's real bad out in CO, but we should be more like them?


[ Parent ]
What I'm saying is... (0.00 / 0)
that there's still a middle ground to be explored when it comes to development in VT.  I'm not on the side of the anti-development crowd nor am I on the side of the "every business and development opportunity is the best thing since sliced bread" crowd.  I think VT has aired more on the side of making development too difficult, expensive, and cumbersome IMO.  

The space that I see that's empty in the Winooski development is mostly the commercial space...same thing out at Maple Tree Place (there's housing in the back of it too...I dunno if it's all occupied...it certainly looks that way).  If you don't think there's a housing crunch in this state, particularily in Chittenden county, then I dunno what to say to you.

If a good project like the Intervale couldn't sustain the six-figure-plus costs to jump through all the hoops that the state wanted them to (rightly or not) jump thru, then what about other types of development?  The current Moran Plant plan is about as green a project as you might find in the real world, and there are still those that want to kill it.  I don't think that's a very smart postion to take.

Be excellent to each other and party on dudes!


[ Parent ]
You're not seeing the forest for the trees (3.50 / 4)
It's not just about the "hoops" - and it therefore isn't analagous to other types of development. That's precisely the conversation Douglas wants to create.

There was an enforcement action.

During the enforcement action, the chief enforcer bragged about the "noose" he had the enforcee in.

That, by any reasoned analysis, would preclude any chance for fair enforcement right there, don't you think? Also given the magical change of status?

And therin lies the real point. It's not about compost, farms or Act 250. It's about a malicious bending/twisting/changing of the rules by a poerson in power for political gain and vindictiveness.

Translation: It's about corruption. Plain, simple, and electorally significant.

undercaffeinated


[ Parent ]
I can see just fine, thanks. (1.00 / 1)
Obviously changing the site's status from a farm or whatever was politically motivated & wrong.  I understand the "conversation" that Jimmy D. wants to create as well, and I don't agree with the message that him & his buddies are trying to put out there...they want to tear down just about every restriction to every type of development.  

I think part of the real discussion here is about composting and farm operations & Act 250.  There needs to be reform in these areas if this state is going to move forward like it needs to.  If every operation that we think is "good" needs to get some kind of special exemption from the rules, then maybe the rules need to be looked at.

What I think you fail to understand is how silly you look when you rush to defend your buddy's compost operation.  It's really not the end of the world, and if you think you're going to score any real political points on the Douglas team with this attack...I think you're crazy...

Be excellent to each other and party on dudes!


[ Parent ]
"my buddy?" (2.50 / 2)
I don't know anybody who works there. I've met Will Raap once. Symington doesn't do anything for them anymore, as I understand it.

Thank you for sharing that you think I look silly for feeling strongly and passionately that this was a politically motivated attack and that we shouldn't be apologists for Jim Douglas. I won't share my feelings on how you look doing so. Lucky you.

undercaffeinated


[ Parent ]
Be excellent, MG.... No debate points scored when you call your opponent crazy. n/t (1.00 / 1)


Nate Freeman

Northfield, VT

natefreeman@gmail.com


[ Parent ]
Ummm... Compost Happens? (4.00 / 3)
Who couldn't see this coming, really?  When I first read about the new legislation specifically supporting composting (at the Intervale) it was pretty easy to see Gaye Symington about to step into her own poop, so to speak.  

So much of politics is about perception vs reality, and this issue contains a huge amount of symbolism.

First, the Intervale isn't just a commercial composter; it's a testament to agriculture in Chittenden County.

Second, the Intervale isn't just a community farm; it's one of the primary gravity centers of Prog/Dem agricultural values.  Symington's name was politically associated to the Intervale last year.

So of course, when the Intervale experiences a runoff issue into the Winooski River from it's composting center, the question isn't about an anonymous dairy farm spewing tons of phosphorous from manure-spread fields; it's about political hypocrisy.  It's about Dem leadership.

And if you think there hasn't been any hypocrisy in Dem leadership here in Vermont, then, well, Compost Happens.

So this just seems like one of those pieces of legislation that was doomed from the get-go.  From the perspective of policy-making, one has to wonder what the formulation process was really like prior to authoring this bill.  Are other composting facilities experiencing the same issue, or is this simply about the Intervale?  (Yes, of course it's simply about the Intervale.)  Were non-legislative solutions considered?  From a political perspective, did anyone stop to think how a bill such as this could be drop-kicked by Douglas?

Given the fact that the House Speaker's name was attached to the issue last year; and also given the leadership's stringent views regarding even the "appearance of corruption" in their campaign finance bill:  wouldn't it possible to foresee the political fallout on this one?  It kind of smacks of cronyism from the point of view of a casual observer.  Sure, it's green, it's good, it's the Intervale, right?  What's not to love?  But that's exactly the point:  justice needs to remain blind; law-making should not exercise preferential policy-making to a particular business or person.

The facts are different from reality in so many ways.  But frankly, this could have been handled a lot better.  

Nate

Nate Freeman

Northfield, VT

natefreeman@gmail.com


[ Parent ]
self-check; other compost operations (3.00 / 1)
Mea culpa -- I was loose with the tongue when I said that this is "simply about the Intervale".

There are at least two other operations in the news regarding this issue.

However, I'll stand on point point about political perception vs. reality.  

Here's the good news:  Mark Johnson is covering the issue at this very moment.  Call in, Bill McK!  It sounds like the reality part is coming through, putting Douglas in his place.

Nate

Nate Freeman

Northfield, VT

natefreeman@gmail.com


[ Parent ]
Political thuggery, yes indeed. (0.00 / 0)
This kind of political thuggery is an A-1 example of why I started BureaucracyBlog, and I'll post a link to your report there soon.

If I may, however, I would suggest that Douglas has won this round, but that doesn't necessarily mean he's won outright and for all time on the Intervale.  If there's enough political will, sufficient pressure could be brought to bear to resurrect it.  It might not be the battle people want to pour their time and resources into.  But based on what you've written, there's a stench to the bureaucratic maneuvers Douglas and Crombie employed to accomplish this coup, and there could well be some detail (or more likely several) where one or the other or both short-sheeted the process, for which they could be taken to task, and perhaps even eventually reversed.

And that's the other thing I'm about over at BureaucracyBlog: documenting strategies that have succeeded in fighting bureaucratic injustice, and generating new strategies to do the same.  Granted we have to pick our battles wisely, but let's do all we can to hold people accountable for such vindictive politics, and also to institute changes that will make it harder for politicians and bureaucrats to pull such crap.

Thanks for the report.

Deb Alicen
bureaucracyblog.com


Gov.Jim Douglas gets a twofer (4.00 / 2)
 Leaving the damp soil alone, the beauty of Gov.Jim Douglas's action  is that his thuggery  can be blamed on act 250 regs. and  enviro bureaucrats.      
The compost site was  hoisted on it's own regulations(petard)after being recategorized into act 250 turf.
The Caledonian Record (read it online weekly or however you want for out of the Chittenden beltway view )had a nice editorial last week bemoaning the lack of good old common sense in the State enviro bureaucracy.Douglas gets a twofer.
Kills compost and blames regs .

how about this (4.00 / 2)
for contrast

the Governor's Engineering Advisory Council just released a report touting VT's "Green Valley" and offering recommendations for "Capturing the Emerging Market for Hollistic Innovation and Expertise".

I guess "holistic innovation" is good unless you are a Dem/Prog working on sustainable farming, solid waste, renewable energy, or alternative transportation.

FYI: I worked for the City of Burlington in the late 80s and early 90s when the state was first promoting recycling. Cities & towns could get substantial financial aid if they adopted mandatory recycling. I worked in CEDO and at the Mayor's request asked George Crombie (Public Woreks Director) to support the program. He declined because "recycling should be done by the private sector". As a result, we wasted a year and lost hundreds of thousands in state aid.

It's all about vision baby.

And BTW - As you reflect on the targets of this mugging, don't overlook the other players. The true visionary behind the Intervale is Will Raap, founder of Gardener's Supply and the Intervale (Foundation) Center. He is a prominent member of VBSR, an outspoken critic of the administration's economic development policies, and (I think) was the treasurer of Scudder Parker's campaign.

In addition, from Douglas' perspective, it's always fun to screw with the City of Burlington - at least as long as it has a Prog Mayor and a Dem majority on the city council.

Bonus points!


shouldn't (4.00 / 4)
This be a big campaign issue? Shouldn't Anthony Pollina be holding a press conference out on top of the intervale compost pile today? (or, for that matter, Peter Galbraith?). Isn't this a chance to knock the nice-guy moniker off jim douglas? And to remind folks what an anti-environmentalist he's proved to be? Shouldn't there be bumperstickers that say: 'save the intervale--fire douglas'. Shouldn't everyone be pointing out how this threatens 7 or 8 % of burlington's fresh food supply? Can't we have some pictures of what the intervale used to look like (i.e., informal dumping ground)? Can't we have pictures contrasting the intervale with the kind of development douglas thinks is environmentally sensible (the st. albans walmart). can't someone organize around this?

This is a freedom-to-farm issue, a local agriculture issue, a revitalized cities issue, a healthy food issue, an abuse-of-power issue. It's a dirty trick that will impact lots of people. Don't campaigns pray for this kind of opportunity?


I can't think of... (0.00 / 0)
a better issue just handed to the Douglas opposition. Pollina is a real fool to let this one slip. Personally, Bill, if you don't mind me saying so, a public statement from you might have a substantial impact, as well.

You can read more of JD Ryan at five before chaos. But why would you want to?

[ Parent ]
Big issues.... (0.00 / 0)
Yes, When an issue falls in the media and nobody responds is it still important ? ...Gov.Jim Douglas has been leaving issues large and small all over.No one is picking them up.Pick 'em up put em together and you have a campaign Candidates declared and undeclared Get thee to a microphone.

[ Parent ]
Only if... (1.00 / 1)
...you want to further cement the unfortunate political victory that the GOP has won on this one.  Championing a compost heap is not going to win a statewide election for either a Dem or a Prog IMO.  There are much bigger fish to fry with Jimmy D. I think.

Be excellent to each other and party on dudes!

[ Parent ]
fry them all up ... (0.00 / 0)
 

[ Parent ]
right operation, wrong site (3.50 / 2)
The intervale compost site was cited on a known archaeological burial ground with no controls to keep floodwaters from washing e. coli into the Winooski.  It is in a 100-year floodplain.  It also did a wonderful job in recycling wastes that would otherwise go into landfills.

I didn't know about the revocation of the Intervale's farm status, but that's almost irrelevant.  Farms are huge polluters (see Missisquoi Bay and St. Albans Bay for example).  They should be subject to the same standards as everyone else.  No one should build on important burial sites.  No one should put pollutants in a floodway without stringent engineering controls.

Everyone should play by the same rules.  And yes, this means coming down hard on anyone who doesn't want to play by these rules.

I hope someone can get another compost site set up in a better location, and soon.  We need another Intervale.


your attack is uncoordinated (0.00 / 0)
You say:

I didn't know about the revocation of the Intervale's farm status, but that's almost irrelevant.

And you say:

Everyone should play by the same rules.

...in applauding the decision. You say everybody should play by the same rules, but think its irrelevant that the rules were vindictively and politically changed in mid-conflict in order to create a pre-decided result - the "noose." That's not "playing  by the same rules." That's a political hit job. It shouldn't be tolerated.

Then you throw in:

this means coming down hard on anyone who doesn't want to play by these rules.

I agree. The Intervale folks were addressing the original problem. But Douglas broke the rules in order to bury them anyway.

I think Vermonters should come down hard on him.

undercaffeinated


[ Parent ]
perhaps it is... (3.00 / 1)
When I say "rules", I mean that any operation should take the necessary actions to prevent pollutants from entering waters of the state, be it a farm, residential subdivision or industrial plant.  IANAL, so I can't really speak to the change in classification of the Intervale.  On its surface, the timing is rather suspect.

Some rules apply regardless of whether act 250 is applicable or not (i.e. wetland impacts).  The archaeological site was known for years to be significant.  It's pretty apparent it's in a floodplain, not my first choice for a large pile of manure to sit unprotected.  If this site was designed correctly to begin with, they wouldn't have left themselves open to a political hit job.


[ Parent ]
blaming the victim (1.00 / 1)
If this site was designed correctly to begin with, they wouldn't have left themselves open to a political hit job.

Which doesn't mitigate Douglas's culpability one whit, any more than the "but she shouldn't have dressed in tight revealing clothes" coupled with "boys will be boys" mitigates an attacker's responsibility for a sexual assault.

undercaffeinated


[ Parent ]
didn't say it did (4.00 / 1)
That's a bad metaphor w.r.t. sexual assualt.  The rules are designed to protect a project during severe weather.  We can't blame nature for sending floods at us like we can a rapist.

[ Parent ]
you're deflecting (1.00 / 1)
The analogy is on the "they shouldn't have asked for it" logic, which is a way of letting the culprits off the hook. You engaged in the exact same logic.

undercaffeinated

[ Parent ]
and of course, the culprit... (0.00 / 0)
...is Douglas. Not the weather. Give me a break.

undercaffeinated

[ Parent ]
I understand how you feel, but... (4.00 / 2)
...I also think verplank is making a separate argument.  Yes, Douglas and Crombie are attempting a political hit job on the Intervale.  I completely agree with you.  

But Verplank has been consistent in prior diaries regarding runoff issues.  (http://www.greenmountaindaily.com/showComment.do?commentId=8392)
That's not the same as forgiving Douglas.  It's simply being accurate in stating a couple of facts Intervale fans don't want to hear:  one, the Intervale was not up to scruff in its handling of compost -- no matter how much we love them for composting 18,000 tons of waste last year; two, even though we can recall photos of car wrecks down on the Intervale prior to its agricultural renewal, there's also burial ground in the area.  That should be considered, no matter what you're doing.  

Nate Freeman

Northfield, VT

natefreeman@gmail.com


[ Parent ]
we're talking about different rules, i think (3.00 / 1)
i'm speaking about the floodplain regs, the stormwater regs, and the archaeological regs.  I think you're talking about the rule that switched the intervale from a farm to a commercial operation?

Are we to let projects off the hook from floodplain regs because their intentions are pure?  I don't think so.


[ Parent ]
who writes the rules? (3.50 / 2)
"No one should put pollutants in a floodway without stringent engineering controls."

Unless your name is IBM, which dumps tons of pollutants into the river every year. Oh wait, they have "stringent engineering controls". Do you think IBM should be forced to move?

"I didn't know about the revocation of the Intervale's farm status, but that's almost irrelevant."

What an incredible thing to say. Bringing farming back to the Intervale (our "other" waterfront) is one of the best things to happen in Burlington in the last 20 years. Or perhaps you prefer to get your food from 3,000 miles away where farmers use chemicals that poison the soil and groundwater and trucks that carry it burn gasoline that pollutes the air?

"Farms are huge polluters (see Missisquoi Bay and St. Albans Bay for example)."

Do you have any evidence - any at all - to support an assertion / inference that Intervale farms have polluted the river or the lake?  


[ Parent ]
When the ..... (4.00 / 2)
status was changed how or who really  managed it ? Whose fingerprints are here ? Forget ,for the time being all the ins and out of composting  and drainage .How was this process started.What ruled, politics or runoff ?  

[ Parent ]
Exactly... (3.00 / 1)
...pay attention to how transparently or shadily this was done, and whether the motivations were the public good or political payback.

Deb Alicen
bureaucracyblog.com


[ Parent ]
asdf (4.00 / 1)
You're missing my point.  The intervale isn't just a farm, it's a large-scale composting operation.  It needs to have its operations protected from natural events such as floods.  I love the idea of the Intervale farm; I'm not so hot on the Intervale compost project.

Farms pollute whenever they use compost or fertilizer on their lands.  Stormwater runoff takes the phosphorous (and maybe e. coli) laden sediment into the river.  I am comfortable in asserting that the Intervale contributed to phosphorus contamination if they used compost or manure for fertilizer.  It's common sense.  We regulate nearly every other land use in this state with respect to stormwater runoff.  Why shouldn't farms be regulated as well?

There's no need to condescend with the "would you rather get your lettuce from California" type questions.  I am a huge fan of local produce, I buy it whenever it is in season.  There are plenty of farms in this area to support, not just the Intervale.  This isn't an either-or scenario.


[ Parent ]
it's not just another farm (3.50 / 2)
The Intervale is not just another farm. It is a collection of small farms (and gardening plots) in the center of the largest city in the state.

Children from the two local (low-income neighborhood) schools go to the Intervale to learn that food doesn't really come from factories; that farmers are stewards as well as businesspersons; that healthy soils matter; that "garbage" is a resource; that fresh food tastes better and is good for you; that science can be fun; that urban farming is not an oxymoron; that native people farmed this same land for hundreds of years; that not all post-dairy agriculture in VT has to be niche products for the well healed; and so on. These kids don't live in rural VT surrounded by farms.

Furthermore, if the stars ever align, there will be food processing facilities in buildings heated by "waste" heat from our municipally owned biomass power plant. More jobs; more synergy; more lessons.

So while there are indeed plenty of farms in the area to support (some incubated in the Intervale), none are quite like the Intervale. It is a treasure to be protected (just like the river and the lake).

BTW - I never said farms shouldn't be regulated. But it's pretty clear that not all regulatory enforcement actions are created equal.  


[ Parent ]
floodplain (3.00 / 1)

There is no secret that floodplain (riverbottom land) makes for great farm land.

Is it the position of Crombie that we revoke farm status for
all agriculture outfits using floodplain?

How does the agency get away with reclassifying a pre-existing operation from a "farm" to "commercial? This needs to be brought into the headlines. This is one thing that won't sit well with any Vermonter.

Every farmer in Vermont should be watching this. Douglas opposition should be filling the news with the notion that the Douglas wants all farms to have an act250 review.

Ths is most certainly a Douglas/Crombie/Republican tactic to dismantle act250. It has a politial smear side effect.

I agree with Bill on this.

I also think that unless Douglas challengers start getting tough on Douglas, we will continue to have Douglas and the Douglas stalemate that will prevent Vermont from moving in any direction.


not the farm that's the problem (4.00 / 1)
It's the large-scale composting facility.  Farms are great on river bottoms.  The Intervale is more than just a farm, and needed to think through some of the engineering challenges of being in a floodplain.

[ Parent ]
understood (3.00 / 1)
but what about haylage, silage, and manure storage facilities that farms use? I do not see much difference.

[ Parent ]
a bit of difference (4.00 / 1)
As I understand it, the Intervale compost facility didn't have any means to either (1) protect the compost pile from rainfall or (2) collect and treat the runoff from rainfall hitting the pile.  IANAF (new term?), but what you referenced all seem like items that can be stored indoors, away from rainfall.

Also, the Intervale collected a wide variety of wastes to make its compost.  A farmer is just working with the products of his site operations (hay, corn, manure).  Special care should be taken with more complex waste streams.


[ Parent ]
as you should also understand (4.00 / 1)
The Intervale was willing to address those concerns.

Douglas didn't want to give them the chance to succeed.

Do you really think the timing is just coincidence? Do you really think the "noose" comment is irrelevant? Do I hear a grinding axe?

undercaffeinated


[ Parent ]
who decided to pack it in? (4.00 / 1)
The Intervale did not choose to address those concerns, that's why they're closing.

I did some more research.  It's a bit frustrating, because I can't find the original Notice of Alleged Violation (NOAV) that started this whole thing (it should be here, right?).  Nonetheless, it looks like Intervale Compost has had an Act 78 (solid waste) permit for some time, they got one in 2002, then was applying for a renewal in 2006.  The DEC stated that they didn't think the Intervale was meeting all the terms of the Act 78 permit, and that was why the NOAV was issued.

The regs are confusing as to composting activities, I can see why the legislature wants to draft a new law about composting facilities.  Anyway, it's always been a bit iffy whether a composting operation needs an Act 250 permit or not, I read a paper from the Composting Association of VT (dated 6/5/07, revised 8/23/07) citing this.  It also says that the regional Act 250 offices should be consulted to see if stormwater permits are needed.  It isn't unique to have the DEC come down on a composting facility check this out:

Vermont Compost Company and Fairmont Farm, Inc., East Montpelier:  Discharge to state waters; failure to operate the composting facility in accordance with the approved management plan, failure to establish a sod filter and maintain a grassed drainage swale, and failure to submit a timely annual report.  AOD 3/29/2005, $7,000 SEP.  (Pelosi, McVeigh / WQ, Schwendtner, Levy)

Sure, this has given Jim a chance to wave a giant middle finger to the Dems and Progs, but similar actions have been taken against other compost facilities before.

Sorry for the lack of links.  Let me know if you'd like to see them, I can post them in another entry.


[ Parent ]
Sure ..... (3.00 / 1)
this has given Jim a chance to wave a giant middle finger to the Dems and Progs

That's a priority for our Gov.Jim Douglas !  

[ Parent ]
Incorrect, and outright misleading (2.50 / 2)
The Intervale was indeed going to address all the concerns in the violation. They stated that publicly. It may have entailed a new system for the lechate, but they were fully ready to comply. You can say otherwise, but you really don't have anything to back that up, because there isn't anything to back that up.

The reason they're closing is primarily the archeological burdens that the magical change in their status was thrusting upon them. The resulting study and mitigation could have gone into six figures. And I don't think anybody would try to suggest that a compost operation would have comparable destructive impacts to archeology the way digging out foundations for office buildings and paving the place would. That's just silly, but it's the silliness mandated by the simple change of status. The change of rules in mid-operation.

Oh, sorry - the noose.

undercaffeinated


[ Parent ]
the arch. thing (3.00 / 1)
So you think that the archaeological concerns were not relevant because of a permit jurisdictional issue?  

The intervale is a very significant archaeological site, regardless of what permits may reply.


[ Parent ]
I think... (0.00 / 0)
...exactly what I said; that there's no comparison between the archeological impact of more typical Act 250 Development vs this sort of ag operation. That the farm classification was more appropriate, and that if there was an argument to be made otherwise, it should have been made at the time the project was started, rather than in this bait-and-switch, capricious manner. Under these circumstances, the archeological argument is clearly suspect, and of questionable honesty as far as ANR is concerned.

undercaffeinated

[ Parent ]
It used to be (4.00 / 1)
that silos were the preferred storage containers for both silage and haylage. But silos are a pain. They require equipment to fill and remove product and are costly. I see more farmers now opt for 3 sided concrete bunkers or plastic wrapped bales for haylage. I don't think too many use silage anymore. They fill these bunkers and cover with plastic and as many tires as will fit on the pile. For manure, a few have slurry storage which are short fat silos, but most have concrete containment structures (pits) that have no tops. These allow rainwater to accumulate and flow over the top in an unchecked manner.

The issue of being on a flood plain is that it floods. Having something covered is a moot point. In the regard, I see no difference between the intervale operation and the multitude of farms that operate on a flood plain.  


[ Parent ]
3rd party issues (3.00 / 1)
farms that are just composting their own stuff aren't subject to review;  it's the commercial composting operations that are being questioned.

that being said, we should find ways to encourage this type of commercial activity  

Nate Freeman

Northfield, VT

natefreeman@gmail.com


[ Parent ]
3rd party issues (0.00 / 0)
farms that are just composting their own stuff aren't subject to review;  it's the commercial composting operations that are being questioned.

that being said, we should find ways to encourage this type of commercial activity  

Nate Freeman

Northfield, VT

natefreeman@gmail.com


[ Parent ]
Ya know... (4.00 / 1)
I can't help but think that Douglas wouldn't have done this if there was actually a chance of him worrying about it on election day.

You can read more of JD Ryan at five before chaos. But why would you want to?

Cools the compost ... (3.00 / 1)
Doesn't it ?

[ Parent ]
So there's no alternative explanation? (0.00 / 0)
I guess I'm not sure. Is there ABSOLUTELY no possibility at all that what happened here is simply a case of ANR doing what it is often criticized for not doing -- enforcing the state's environmental laws?

I heard Bob Kiss and Ginny Lyons on Mark Johnson this morning, and while both of them hinted that this was a politically motivated enforcement action, neither one of them produced any evidence. I presume if they had more than supposition they would have shared it. And neither of them came out and said that the Intervale was innocent, that there had not been any violations of the law.

Ultimately, didn't Bill Sorrell have to sign off on any enforcement action? If so, it can hardly be called political.


It's possible that we're all descended from ancient astronauts from space... (0.00 / 0)
...but you have to willingly - or willfully - ignore an awful lot of real evidence to allow yourself to come to that conclusion.

Same thing applies here.

undercaffeinated


[ Parent ]
ya know (3.50 / 2)
the whole thing is a damn shame.  The way that this was gone about.  The way the intervale kind of overgrew its britches.

How did we go from from doing a good thing like reducing waste and creating compost to being a polluter?

Unfortunately I will agree with what we know about the archeological sites along the Winooski there are sensitive spots that should be avoided.

At the same time before it was cleaned up 20 some odd years ago, it was where everybody dumped everything, and other than a couple hayfields it was a wasteland.

Foresight was lacking here though, such a large scale composting facility probably shouldn't have been built in a floodplain.

I don't let the state off the hook here, because if they're so concerned, they should be coughing up a new site for such an environmentally sustaining project.

I really think the state should have considered letting the compost facility phase into a newer site, within a given period.  

To pull the rug out from under someone trying to do the right thing for the environment is ridiculous.

Yes, there's problems, but come up with solutions, not more problems!!

See The Complete Catalog Of Everything I Have To Say At www.rednalsiofvermont.blogspot.com


a few tidbits of information (3.33 / 3)
Given that I was one of the two attacked by the Republican Party last fall I probably should not get too involved here.  Except that the attack was totally off base.

But I would like to add a few thoughts to this discussion.

I agree that not all was handled well, but lets make sure some facts are not lost in the interpretation of articles read and statements put out.

1) There has not been shown any run-off from the compost operation to the winooski river.

2) There was cited concern that the leachate "may" have contaminated groundwater.  That "may" has been repudiated with groundwater engineering studies by a local respected environmental engineering firm.

3) The ACT 250 language that came to the legislature was brought to the Committee by one of its own members, who happens to the be the Rep. for Montpelier.  The same city where Vermont Compost Company (VCC) resides.  That is the company that was given a recent jurisdictional opinion (JO) stating that they needed at ACT 250 permit regarding thier operations on a nearby farm with that farms manure.

4) The House Agriculture Committee has been taking testimony and discussing this issue throughout this session to get a better understanding of the 26+ different permits that are required for a composting operation like the intervale.  We have also heard that the Composting Association of Vermont has begun working on a 1-2 year review of state laws/permits along with the Agency of Agriculture and the Agency of Natural Resources to try to get a more understandable (not weaker) set of permits.  Because composting is somewhere between a solid waste facility and an agricultural operation it has been stuck in "no-mans land".  We have not taken any action yet because we want to have more complete understanding of the various facts.  However, when mid-stream the JO came out about VCC, I can understand how the Rep. from Montpelier jumped into action...even if it appeared to come out of the blue.  When the Freeps reporter asked me last week about the bill, and tried to tie it to the Intervale, I told her what I thought...that it had to do with VCC.

5) In fact, the language that passed would do nothing for the Intervale as they are already in operation and the language in the House version was not applied retroactively.

6) As a farmer in the Intervale I will tell you that farm phosphorus run-off occurs when too much is applied and when it then rains before it is incorporated into the soil.  Particularly on sloping land where it washes into nearby streams.  The farmers of the Intervale spread compost and work it in right away.  Also, because the intervale soils are sandy, sandy loam, there is virtually no surface run-off even when it does rain fairly heavily.

7) The floods that occur in the Intervale tend to happen in the spring before we have spread anything, but even when they are later, the product has been incorporated because we do that quickly to not lose any nutrients to volotization (sp?).

8) Without knowing everything about the compost operation (I buy their product and drive by it everyday...just like most of you and your local grocery store.  But do not know the delivery schedules, quantities etc., just as you do not know the deliverys to your local store), but having done some digging due to my role in the legislature, it is my understanding that they created the "lagoons" to capture the run-off from the piles and then either put the liquid back on the piles (when they were dryer) or out on fallow fields that had the capacity to absorb the fluid.

9) I will add that the Intervale is not perfect. There are certainly aspects of this that they could have handled better.  However it is my understanding that they have consistently worked to correct whatever they are told they are doing incorrectly.  But that they have also had difficulty getting straight answers from the Agencies with respect to what they are supposed to do.  That is where the Adminstration has been lacking.  While the Douglas folks MO may be to eliminate permiting etc., their other MO is to make it easier for businesses to navigate the system.  This is where they have failed to follow through on their rhetoric.  If they were interested in "green jobs" and retaining "young people" in the state, then they would have worked more cooperatively with a business that wanted to correct (not fight) what ever they were doing incorrectly.

It is a mess. There is no easy fix.  But I recall a few years ago there was a similar mess with stormwater permits (remember Lowe's, etc.).  Expired permits, violated permits, unclear regulations, etc.  Maybe we can learn something from that and figure out how to make it work both for the composting to continue as well as to make sure the waterways do not get contaminated.


a few questions (3.00 / 1)
David,

Thanks for the detailed reply.  I had a couple questions regarding your statement:

1. In the past 4 years, there have been severe rain events, exceeding the 10-year storm event, and from what I have read, there is no stormwater discharge permit for the site.  Does the Intervale have stormwater mitigation measures sufficient to hold larger storm events without any discharge to the Winooski?

2. You say the Intervale has groundwater data proving there is no phosphorous contamination.  However, in #8, you state that runoff collected in excavated lagoons is put out onto fallow fields.  Presumably, this runoff contains pollutants such as phosphorus.  Was there data taken in the areas where lagoon water was discharged?

3. One last note on phosphorous: recent research by UVM indicates that contrary to conventional wisdom, there is a significant portion of phosphorous that remains in water, and able to be transported to rivers during rain events.  It probably is not safe to assume that all phosphorous is collected in soil.

I hope this issue results in a clearer permit process for commercial composters.  The stormwater permit nightmare is bad enough for everyone, we don't need to have any more permit confusions.


[ Parent ]
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